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What is a Vesting Order obtained by AIGON? Can I make a negotiated settlement (with discounts) for 8 year old Debt? Can the 6 years Limitation apply?

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asked on Sep 7, 2020 at 21:44
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edited on Sep 7, 2020 at 23:23
by   jeff005


Pic of a  VESTING ORDER  (Courtesy of @Keribang).

There are discussions under these threads :

1.  Ref :  https://www.lawyerment.com/answers/questions/13770/forewarning-cimb-selling-debts-to-debts-collector-aiqon?g=1#tab-top

2.  Ref :  https://www.lawyerment.com/answers/questions/13790/settlement-to-a-14-years-dept?g=1#tab-top

3.  Ref :  https://www.lawyerment.com/answers/questions/13839/receiving-calls-from-aiqon-capital-saying-i-owe-money

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answered on Nov 9, 2021 at 01:02
by  
edited Nov 9, 2021 at 01:07
by   bobbyjarvis
Hi @jeff005

I have recently been receiving calls from AiGon too (thanks to the NotSoMySejahtera data breach i think, as my number is not in my name) regarding my AmBanx HP car loan which was eventually auctioned off with shortfall.

She said i owe them now RM30k++, and now willing to offer me a payment plan, for which i replied you cant expect me to to pay for something which i dont have any details... Please furnish me with the full details of the RM30k++ debt.
She continued blabbering abt maybe interest, etc, payment plan, bla bla... which i interupted by saying i dont understand anything that you say just send me the details of this debt, which she then sent me a HGL (Letter telling the debt has been acquired by AiGon). Thats it!!!

FYI, my shortfall with Ambanx was only about RM15k++ and that was in 2007!

Total Loan Facility with Interest was abt RM45k (RM30k+ principal and RM10k+ interest)
Car auctioned off for a measly RM8,500 only (1/3 the value of the principal???)
Paid installments abt RM20k+ (2/3 the value of the principal)

So shortfall is only about RM15k++, with additional interest from Ambanx (interest upon shortfall which incl interest?)

1. Firstly is the transfer of debt to AiGon legal? This is afterall a shortfall wherby the car has been auctioned circa 2007
2. Secondly how did the figure blow up to RM30k++? Can AiGon charge interest legally?
3. Thirdly its been more than 10 years and nobody has taken up this to court, why now? It is way past the Limitation Act's 6 year period.
4. There is no mention of this "debt" in CCRIS or CTOS, and as far as i know there never was!!!

Appreciate your feedback
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answered on Nov 9, 2021 at 15:17
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edited Nov 9, 2021 at 15:29
by   jeff005
@bobbyjarvis

Just short notes :

1. Insist on statement of acs from aiQon as proof of debt.

2. Never ask for "discounts", this constitute as admission of debt which will void the protection under the Limitation Act 2018.

3. Never even pay RM10 as "documentation fee".

4. After receiving any further docs, post here for discussion.

Notes
1. I have received your CCRIS dated oct2021. It actually tells a good fact that you would NOT be given a C.C. this year if there is a blacklisting by BNM.

2. I have received CTOS dated Nov 2020. There is another fact. There has been no legal case. But the safest is to go to court to check as your case are in hard copy (2007) and may not appear in "online" court records (just like what Dr. Haris had done).

3. I have received the "Vesting Order" send to you jointly (the HGL) by AB/Aiqon.
However, i'm not comfortable with such "msgs" as there were cases of fake docs going online nowadays. If you still have records of the HPA signed, it should tally with the number stated in the Vested Order. Never never take any value stated in any vested order as it can be purely exacerbated "interests" which can be contested by the debtor in court.

(to be continued)
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answered on Nov 9, 2021 at 23:36
by  
edited Nov 9, 2021 at 23:55
by   jeff005
@bobbyjarvis

I shall answer to the above Query first :

1. Firstly is the transfer of debt to AiGon legal? 
Yes it is legal via a Court Order obtained at the High Court.
How were you made aware of the auction? By the bank or informed by aigoon?

2. Can AiGon charge interest legally?
The debt buyer can charge interests legally provided :

a) This debt have been accorded a Judgment Debt in a lawsuit before and interests can be charged 6 years from date of JDebt according to what has been stated in the Court Perintah. In the Vesting Order, the seller (bank) have passed the rights to the new creditor.

b) In the event of no lawsuit (no JD), then aigoon cannot charge as it is not a financial institution. But they will always charge to exacerbate the total amount and then offer a big "discount". All these are window dressings as well as MalJustice (in my personal opinion). It can be contested in a court of law (if they try to file a lawsuit).

3. Thirdly its been more than 10 years and nobody has taken up this to court, why now?
Because igoons found you via sejahtera breach. Hackers always wins.

Sejahtera recent breach 3 days ago. 
My son was also a victim


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answered on Nov 10, 2021 at 00:02
by  
edited Nov 10, 2021 at 01:22
by   jeff005
4. There is no mention of this "debt" in CCRIS or CTOS, and as far as i know there never was!!!
Both CCRIS and CTOS is never 100% accurate.
The bank may not have updated BNM of "anything" but may update to CTOS to blacklist the debtor. Unethical but at least now, BNM have suspended CTOS.

Refer to my this article under this forum :

https://www.lawyerment.com/answers/questions/14061/no-ccris-access-for-credit-reporting-agencies-for-now-bernama-october-1-2021

Edit :
To check if you have been made a JD before, you have to go personally to any courts. But you may have to call to the court you are going to see if you need to make an appointment first (just like immigration depts).
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answered on Nov 14, 2021 at 00:08
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WHAT DO I DO WITH COURT ORDER
WHAT DO I DO WITH COURT ORDER?
When you obtained a judgment against the opposing party, you are first required to serve the judgment.

Upon receiving the judgment, the opposing party must obey the terms ordered against him/her by the Court.

If the opposing party fails or refuses to comply with the order, our legal system provides several types of enforcement procedures.

 
ENFORCEMENT OF JUDGMENT
Judgment Debtor Summons
i) If you are enforcing the judgment you are referred to as the judgement creditor and the opposing party as the judgment debtor.
ii) This is an application which can be used for discovery of information on the assets and financial means of the judgment debtor.
iii) The judgment debtor will be called to appear before the Judge/Magistrate.
iv) The Court can order the judgment debtor to pay the judgement sum either in one lump sum or instalments.
v) If the judgment debtor fails to comply with the Court order, he will be called upon again to show cause why he should not be imprisoned.
 
Writ of Seizure and Sale
i) This application is applicable to movable properties.
ii) The Court will command the Sheriff or Bailiff to seize and sell of the property of the judgment debtor to satisfy the judgment sum due.
iii) This process will be carried out through an auction of the seized items.
iv) The proceeds will be channeled to the Judgement Creditor.
 
Writ of Possession
i) This application is exclusively for immovable properties.
ii) The Court directs the Sheriff/Bailiff to enter and take possession of the Judgment Debtor’s property.
iii) The seized property will be auctioned off to satisfy the judgment debt.
 
Garnishee Proceedings
i) A Garnishee application may be applied to attach monies owed from a judgment debtor’s bank account to satisfy the sum due.
ii) The Court will order the judgment debtor’s banks to attach whatever amount in the judgment debtor’s bank account to satisfy the judgment debt owed to the judgment creditor.
iii) In the first process the judgment creditor may obtain an order to attach/ freeze the judgment debtor’s bank account. iv) In the second stage the Court will order the Bank to remit the monies in the account to the judgement creditor to satisfy the judgment. 
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answered on Nov 24, 2021 at 11:51
by  
i have a question. My debt was also sold to Aiqon and the amount is not big. i am thinking of getting a loan after so many years, and I wonder if those debt has been bought by aiqon, will it still show in ccris after 7 years? and izzit paying Aiqon really clear off any so called blacklisting in CCRIS. 
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answered on Nov 24, 2021 at 13:03
by  
edited Nov 24, 2021 at 13:21
by   jeff005
@ Fukusan

Hai dude..

Debts bought by aiQon does not appear in BNM CCRIS.

Go and apply for a BNM CCRIS and see things for yourself.. !!
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answered on Nov 24, 2021 at 16:38
by  
oh ok, im about to do so. tks for the enlightenment. 
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answered on Nov 25, 2021 at 16:26
by  
Repost :

WHAT DO I DO WITH COURT ORDER?
When you obtained a judgment against the opposing party, you are first required to serve the judgment.

Upon receiving the judgment, the opposing party must obey the terms ordered against him/her by the Court.

If the opposing party fails or refuses to comply with the order, our legal system provides several types of enforcement procedures.

 
ENFORCEMENT OF JUDGMENT
Judgment Debtor Summons
i) If you are enforcing the judgment you are referred to as the judgement creditor and the opposing party as the judgment debtor.
ii) This is an application which can be used for discovery of information on the assets and financial means of the judgment debtor.
iii) The judgment debtor will be called to appear before the Judge/Magistrate.
iv) The Court can order the judgment debtor to pay the judgement sum either in one lump sum or instalments.
v) If the judgment debtor fails to comply with the Court order, he will be called upon again to show cause why he should not be imprisoned.
 
Writ of Seizure and Sale
i) This application is applicable to movable properties.
ii) The Court will command the Sheriff or Bailiff to seize and sell of the property of the judgment debtor to satisfy the judgment sum due.
iii) This process will be carried out through an auction of the seized items.
iv) The proceeds will be channeled to the Judgement Creditor.
 
Writ of Possession
i) This application is exclusively for immovable properties.
ii) The Court directs the Sheriff/Bailiff to enter and take possession of the Judgment Debtor’s property.
iii) The seized property will be auctioned off to satisfy the judgment debt.
 
Garnishee Proceedings
i) A Garnishee application may be applied to attach monies owed from a judgment debtor’s bank account to satisfy the sum due.
ii) The Court will order the judgment debtor’s banks to attach whatever amount in the judgment debtor’s bank account to satisfy the judgment debt owed to the judgment creditor.
iii) In the first process the judgment creditor may obtain an order to attach/ freeze the judgment debtor’s bank account. iv) In the second stage the Court will order the Bank to remit the monies in the account to the judgement creditor to satisfy the judgment.
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answered on Apr 2, 2022 at 15:20
by  
Example of payment made to "new Creditor" under vesting order.

The Statement of Accounts would appear as such :

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