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Entering Malaysia after NTL

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asked on May 7, 2018 at 17:27
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edited on Jun 4, 2018 at 00:10
 
Dear Mr Jeff,

I know many have already asked about the NTL stamp (and I have read each of your answers to the cases at least 3 times if not more!), but I’m hoping you might have some further advice for me based on your experience, in order for me to help my fiancé return to Malaysia. I will try to be detailed without being too boring!

The background: In 2015, I moved back from Switzerland to Malaysia to assist with my family business. My fiancé (then-boyfriend), a Swiss, moved with me and secured an IT job in KL and work permit from MDEC. However, he decided to quit in March 2017 in order to explore opportunities to develop his own software. So for the last year, he was on tourist 90-day short-term social visit passes. During the year, before the end of 90 days, he made a 3-week trip back to Switzerland and we also made a 3-week trip to the US together. However, for the last 2 exits, he went to Singapore as we had an event to attend and stayed for a few days both times. 

In the mean time, he had also applied for the MTEP (Malaysian Tech Entrepreneur Program) visa via MDEC, as he planned to start his IT company here and this seemed like a suitable program. However, at the end of March, this visa wasn’t approved yet. They had rejected him initially on the basis of the project not covering some of their criteria but the executives had visited him at his co-working place and discussed the project with him, and were pretty supportive, so they allowed him to rework his pitch deck to appeal. The appeal meeting was meant to be in April. 

On the 2nd trip back from Singapore at the end of March, at KLIA2 the immigration officer refused his entry and he was given an NTL. Unfortunately I had cleared immigration via the autogate, so he was discussing with the officers on his own. By the time I was let back into the immigration office, they had already stamped his NTL. Too late :( Reason for NTL was the multiple entries to Malaysia, “without any proof of reason” and without sufficient cooling period, according to one of the officers at KLIA2. They did not care about his pending MTEP visa application. We had to stay for 18 hours at the immigration office, before they put him on a flight back to Singapore (accompanied by immigration/Air Asia). In Singapore, immigration officers there also asked him to return to Europe, so he did. 

It was unfortunate that we did not rush to complete our marriage registration before all this happened. We certainly took it for granted and was banking on the MTEP visa to give us a year to slowly plan, especially since he hadn’t really started his business yet and so wasn’t in a financial state to host some big parties. We now have all the documents ready for the ROM and wish to do it in Malaysia so that it will make applying for the LTSVP spouse visa easier (since we will still be here for a few more years at least), and the ROM approval process in Europe takes a much longer time. The question now is whether immigration will let him in again after this NTL (and I hope you’ll be able to help shed some light on this!)

He is hoping to re-enter at the end of May. This would be slightly more than 1.5 months (53 days) after the NTL was given. We have prepared all the documents required for the registration application (civil status cert and birth cert have been endorsed by Malaysian embassy in Switzerland, so we need to translate it and and get Wisma Putra endorsements, which we were planning to do when he brings the documents with him). We already have return tickets back to Zurich before the end of 90 days (staying for 3 weeks). I also will fly to Singapore to meet him there and fly back together with him to Malaysia in order to face the immigration officer together! We also have plenty of Facebook photos to prove our relationship if necessary :p 

Do you think all this is sufficient to satisfy the immigration officer, or will the NTL record be a problem? Please advise me if there are other documents we should prepare, anything I should say/do or NOT say/do(!) or if there will be other issues that we haven’t thought about… I would very much hate to put him through another NTL, or worse! We would greatly appreciate any advice you have.. Thank you in advance!
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answered on May 8, 2018 at 02:55
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edited Jun 4, 2018 at 00:58
 
@tanch

1. Come direct from Switzerland to Malaysia. If he comes from another country, he would be denied entry again.

2. Come after the 60 days.

3. I suppose Singapore also denied him entry but did not stamp NTL on his passport but may do so on his next trip.

4. The issue is he is "hopping" from one country to another. This mode of travel is no longer accepted nowadays. This problem is because the human traffickers, the extremists bombers in Thailand, Bali, The Philippines are using the same tactics to hide their travels.

5. Come direct flight from Switzerland to Malaysia. He can exit once only to another country and then enter again, but after the second time, the 3rd time for sure he get a NTL by the giving of all sorts stupid excuses by the Immigration.

6. Get him to go to the Malaysian Embassy in Switzerland with the Marriage Documents to apply for a VFR (Visa For Reference). Over there, they may call it by another name/term. The purpose of this type of Visa is for the purpose to get things done in Malaysia, for your case, Marriage.

7. After getting the Marriage Certificate, then go to the Immigration to apply for the Long Term Social Visit pass (LTSV Pass) (Note that there is no such thing as Spouse Visa in Malaysia).

Good Luck, do not enter Malaysia from Singapore this important trip, he may get a NTL from Singapore too. They may redirect him back to Switzerland.
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answered on May 8, 2018 at 08:46
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edited Jun 4, 2018 at 01:01
 
Hi Jeff, thanks for the quick response.

His ticket is a return Zurich-Singapore ticket via BA but the plan is to get on the next flight to KL and I will wait for him in Singapore airport in order to accompany him at Malaysian Immigration. Do you think this kind of transfer/transit is okay? (if without checked in baggage, then i think he can head to the gate immediately and not need to clear immigration in Singapore.) 

I have tried asking for a visa with reference from Malaysian Embassy but they informed me no such visa exists because Swiss passport holders are allowed 90 days stay in Malaysia without a visa. The only one they can issue is when we get the LTSVP :( 
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answered on May 8, 2018 at 13:00
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edited Jun 4, 2018 at 01:06
 
Do you think this kind of transfer/transit is okay?
I have never flown to Singapore before so I do not know how is the airport clearance system. I am a Johor Baru_ean.

But basing on the other airports, once out of the plane, you go straight to the immigration counters before collecting baggage. After collecting baggage then proceed to "Customs Check Counter".

You all do not know the legal implications at the immigration counters. For legal charges (eg. Prohibited Drugs), the stamp entry in the passport is required to charged people in a Court of Law (inbound country).

The same issue may occur. Denied Entry. Come direct from Swiss - okay. If they turn him back again this time, they may classified him as a "Prohibited Immigrant" under another section of the Immigration Act.
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answered on May 14, 2018 at 17:34
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edited Jun 4, 2018 at 01:08
 
Thanks Jeff. We have now changed his flight to go to KLIA directly. You're right, I think not a good idea to go via Singapore even if he doesn't need to go in and out of immigration there. Had to burn my Firefly flights! I will also fly into KLIA separately and clear immigration with him. If you can think of any document I need to bring along with me, do let me know! I'm also writing a letter to state that I'm supporting him financially etc. 

By the way we again wrote the Malaysian Embassy in Switzerland and they gave us a written reply saying they have no visa to offer him as it doesn't exist. They said to check with Immigration for clearance, but I do not know how to get such a written clearance from Immigration here.  I have had verbal reassurances from front desk officers when I went to Putrajaya to try to get some hints (one officer said can come in anytime even though got NTL, just go with him in person and also have our documents to prove we are marrying etc), but verbal is no good as it is then down to your luck when you come to KLIA. 

Thanks again and wish us luck!!!! It's the longest I have had to go without being with him and it is no fun! 
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answered on May 14, 2018 at 18:03
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edited Jun 4, 2018 at 01:13
 
they have no visa to offer him as it doesn't exist.

These embassy officers never learn. On the official Immigration website, Swiss nationals needs a Visa. The only thing is they get free VOA (Visa On Arrival) and a Social Visit Pass of 90 days.

For marriage purposes, the 90 days for Marriage with Foreign Spouse is enough but not so for Islamic Marriages (6 months also cannot sometimes).

For His case
1.  He has to bring enough cash as per entry requirement.
2.  Invitation letter from you and that he is staying in your premise, of course, your contact numbers and address.
3.  Have your photostated MyKad and blank documents for Marriage with Foreign Spouse would suffice.

Then, do not go oversea yet for Honeymoon until you get the Marriage Certificate..!! You must be careful as there were  NTL's on his passport before. Apply for Long Term Social Visit pass (LTSVP) once you receive the Marriage Certificate..

Happy Blissful Marriage and Wedding!
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answered on May 22, 2018 at 12:49
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edited Jun 4, 2018 at 01:15
 
Hi Jeff,

We managed to clear immigration successfully! I went off for holiday over the weekend and flew in to KLIA to clear immigration together. The officer at the counter was very nice, BUT he could not stamp him in due to the NTL. He sent us to the immigration office (what a sad place, I really don't like being in these offices as people are getting turned away, crying etc, been there, done that!). Anyway, there I showed them his ticket out of the country in August (before expiry of 90 days), and all the documents we needed for the Jabatan Pendaftaran Negara (JPN) registration. He said "oh lama lagi" (marrying in August) but I explained we still needed to do the application for ROM. Finally was stamped through. Phew. 

Officer said for future entries, just show marriage certificate (and until we have that, they will continue to question him at arrival points and maybe have to go immigration office again, no thanks). I will definitely get it as soon as possible, also apply for LTSVP as soon as possible.

It would have been much better if he could have gotten the Short term SVP in advance, but I contacted embassy people multiple times (I have good contact with one since I lived there for many years) but they just said not possible. Doesn't make sense to me lah. Just because can get VOA doesn't mean they shouldn't give you in advance if you need -_- I hope these kind of regulations get cleaned up soon. 

Also for reference of others, nowadays when checking in for a flight to Malaysia, they are asking to see either your work permit or else your return ticket portion out of Malaysia, and this needs to be within your allowed visit pass duration (30 or 90 days). They actually key it into the system during check in now. Looks like a new rule as my friend told me about it last week and indeed they did ask my fiancé during check in. 

Thanks again Jeff for your kind advice and well wishes! All the best to you! May you earn lots of good karma for your help on this forum. 
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answered on May 22, 2018 at 15:41
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edited Jun 4, 2018 at 01:19
 
@ tanch

Wow.. wow.. 2 good news came on the same day. It really makes a very good day except now it is thunderstorm in KL now.

Congrats..

May you earn lots of good karma for your help on this forum. 
Thank you very much.. I may still need a couple of hundreds of solved cases before I can make an application to the High Court Of Malaya for Nirvana.. But then, may have to go up a cold mountain top to find me.

Cheers..

Start your marriage application now. You can have a registered marriage first, then a grand dinner. Book now, August are "marriageable" months for Singles..
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answered on May 22, 2018 at 22:19
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edited Jun 4, 2018 at 01:21
 
@ tanch 

Comments on the below procedures..

Also for reference of others, nowadays when checking in for a flight to Malaysia, they are asking to see either your work permit or else your return ticket portion out of Malaysia, and this needs to be within your allowed visit pass duration (30 or 90 days). They actually key it into the system during check in now.
This has been on for the past year. Airlines are tracking tourists movement. Airport Authorities are tracking Tourists Traffic, the Immigration is tracking for undesirable elements. It is just that all your previous trips were smooth except during the marriage period. 

What you all did not observe is that there are codes on your boarding tickets, there are codes written on the Immigration exit stamps. Post most of your exit stamps here and I will show you..  But not "Mumbai" airport.. hahaha

or else your return ticket portion out of Malaysia,
This is not really the main criteria as return bookings can be changed, cancelled and some monies refunded. Many were given NTL at entry points even if they have pre approved / pre-paid visa and return ticket. The Immigration works independently. Sometimes at the discretionary powers of that officer inside that blinking office.
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answered on May 22, 2018 at 22:55
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edited Jun 4, 2018 at 01:23
 
@tanch

Read here @Ann Shi

It is an indication on what may come next..
https://www.lawyerment.com/answers/questions/11881/im-96-c-and-b-b6?g=1

But it may not affect you much as Swiss has 90 Days. Do they have Multiple Entries?

It is the sharing of information in this forum that we learn things. I just learn from  @carrie1226 on how to get 90 days stay in China when normally it is 30 days, Read here..

https://www.lawyerment.com/answers/questions/12735/i-am-a-bankrupt-and-have-left-malaysia-my-passport-is-expiring-soon

You would not see it as it is in the bankruptcy section.
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answered on May 23, 2018 at 12:24
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edited Jun 4, 2018 at 01:24
 
Officer said for future entries, just show marriage certificate (and until we have that, they will continue to question him at arrival points and maybe have to go immigration office again
This successful trip will erase the NTL..  Stupid statement from officer.

Just avoid being a grasshopper, if possible, on a single outbound trip from country of origin.

Apply for Multiple Entries Visa. There is, but don't know why his country does not have. I am puzzled too.
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