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Can I Be Bankrupted?

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asked on May 1, 2017 at 21:52
by   sallysm
Hi,
I have some issues I need help to clarify. Hope you guys can help shed some light.

This morning I received a call from "someone" saying that he is at my house to give me a "Notis Bankrup". I was not at home (Labour Day holiday).
I dont even know that this is possible until I google and read a few forums here.

My question is if they managed to "serve" me, should I attend court? I was away overseas last year (2015 - 2016) but I still pay my PL but maybe sometimes a bit late payment but I still pay. I received calls/ whatsapp from bank/debt collector while I was oversea, sometimes I replied, sometimes I ignored because they are simply rude. But I still pay my installments via online banking.
Since July 2016, my payments are late and I have 3 months in arrears. I am still paying the installments and I have another 3K only to make my account current with no outstanding. I plan to pay the default months by end of May. Then I will be on track again.
THEN, I got this call.
Should I ignore or should I let him "serve my notice"? I can afford to pay my installments because I have a good job offer now and I just came back to Malaysia last month to start working again.

Can someone help/advise me what should I do? Should I attend court and tell judge to dismiss my case and I continue to pay my installments as usual? Is it possible to dismiss case? or any other suggestions? I don't want to be bankrupt. 

PL : 132K  (without interest etc) total after interest etc 215K

What should I do next? Pls help. Thanks.
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answered on May 3, 2017 at 03:36
by   jeff005
edited May 3, 2017 at 05:51
by   jeff005
@ sallysm

As i have stated earlier, since you were NOT in the country, anything could had happened.
You did not even know you were made a Judgement Debtor. So you have kena J.I.D.

Can the bank put the status in CCRIS report as bankruptcy although in my case is not bankrupt yet?
Bankruptcy is just a term used there. It did not state that you are a bankrupt. If it is stated there AO/RO is out.. (yes, you are a BANKRUPT).

Based on their letter, Bank don't want to update CCRIS until full loan amount is paid ($200K) which is another 8 years tenure. If I read correctly, this is almost like bankrupt too?  
You have read wrongly. Not a bankrupt but have committed an act of bankruptcy.
Sorry, this will remain there for ages. Even after the loan have been fully settled, they would just put a remark there to indicate "loan settled".

Is there any laws about creditors 'wrongful penalisations' to debtors or "wrongful accused before judgement" thing? 
Based on what you have stated above, my personal opinion, you are at fault. 
Read thru some of the past cases documented in this forum and find out what are the faults you COULD have committed. Understand what went wrong, then you will learn how to fight your own case.

Can I fight this with some legal Acts if any?
How and what to fight when there were wrongdoings on your part? 

Can I fight for them to update the CCRIS and put it together with the affidavit?
Is CCRIS is involved in your bkcy case? Put nonsense, not relating to this lawsuit, in any affidavits, is not going to help your fight. CCRIS is a listing, fight for what? De-listing?

Anyone has a sample of affidavit? I will also browse old posts but if you guys have it already
Catch a fish for you to eat, you eat one time. Teach you how to fish, you eat for life.
Everybody case can be slightly different. By copying other people affidavits is akin to committing suicide when the next round of hearing, some things may changes.

Q's
1. When is your court hearing (case management)
2. Post here in full the whole contents of the letter from the bank. Is it an offer letter or just a computer generated standard format with general "information"?
3. After the first "Reply Affidavit" is filed, what is the next step?

Writing nonsense in any court affidavits, you, maybe can hear the bank lawyer screaming like a mental nut.......  Liar Liar Liar... Bantahan Bantahan Bantahan. maybe in front of the High Court Judge. This is High Court not ordinary Majistrate Court dear..!!!
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answered on May 3, 2017 at 03:46
by   jeff005
edited May 3, 2017 at 03:51
by   jeff005
This is the main content of the letter---
Wrong.. this is the most useless part of the letter !!!
Nothing to do with the bkcy proceedings.

Listen to "notalawyer" pre-emptive attack..
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answered on May 3, 2017 at 04:38
by   notalawyer
Tindakan guaman hanya akan dihentikan setelah semua tunggakan diselesaikan sepenuhnya dengan kadar segera.
Although you may think that you have enough money to clear all the outstandings,
sometimes you may come short ( not quite enough ) or the bank keep on increasing the outstanding amount or unexpected expenses surface. ( like car need repair or medical bills )
The bank is not going to show you any mercy if you don't settle all outstandings quickly.
The safest way out for you is to fight the Bankruptcy Notice in Court and defeat it.
This way, the bank will think twice before starting another Bankruptcy proceeding against you again in the future.

Pengemaskinian maklumat pelanggan di dalam sistem CTOS/CCRIS hanya akan diuruskan setelah baki pembiayaan dijelaskan sepenuhnya.
There is no problem being blacklisted, unless you plan to take another bank loan!
Haven't you had enough troubles with borrowings?

I also went to Bank Negara, just to double confirm on my CCRIS report. The legal status column in the report is 'Bankruptcy" dated in January. I was still oversea at that time. 
Can the bank put the status in CCRIS report as bankruptcy although in my case is not bankrupt yet?

The word Bankruptcy in the CCRIS report means there is an ongoing bankruptcy proceeding against you or you are a bankrupt. It does not necessarily mean that are a bankrupt.

Based on their letter, Bank don't want to update CCRIS until full loan amount is paid ($200K) which is another 8 years tenure. If I read correctly, this is almost like bankrupt too? 
Wait till you become a bankrupt, then you will wish you are only blacklisted.

Is there any laws about creditors 'wrongful penalisations' to debtors or "wrongful accused before judgement" thing? Can I fight this with some legal Acts if any?
Blacklisting is merely to warn other banks about you, no wrongful punishments here.
You can also blacklist Bank Rakyat by warning all your friends and relatives to avoid this bank.
Life is fair.

Can I fight for them to update the CCRIS and put it together with the affidavit suggested by @notalawyer?
Consider the case where a hypermarket paste a photo of a shoplifter on their Notice Board.
Can the shoplifter sue the hypermarket and win?

You seem have a lot of fighting spirit.
Maybe you can join Avengers Malaysia and help others to fight banks.
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answered on May 3, 2017 at 05:44
by   jeff005
edited May 3, 2017 at 05:59
by   jeff005
@ notalawyer

Can this firebird last? She is firing blanks at the moment.

Facts.
1. Since the N.K. despatch guy is willing to work on May 1st, there is a serious hint of urgency there. Could mean this is the last hand service.

2. She has been made a J.D., she only think of outstanding 3 instalments, what about litigation costs for the J.I.D.? Lawyers fess, court fees, accrued interests, default charges for the past 1,2 years? Lawyers fees for this current bankruptcy proceedings estimated to be in the region of 8-10K? What about Bill Collectors billings? It is sure not going to be the 3, 6K she may have in mind.

3. One may think that it is only 3 month installments, but fact is it in most cases it has fallen into the 4th month default due to the start month, end month period (cut off date).

4. Even a one month defaulted payment attracts late payment penalties, what more if it is 3 months behind installments? In actual fact, every month COULD have exceeded the 3 months NPL criteria which prompted the bank to execute litigation proceedings, now bkcy proceedings.
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answered on May 4, 2017 at 03:45
by   sallysm
Hi 
@kiki @jeff005 @notalawyer

Teach you how to fish, you eat for life. 
I agree. I'm learning now and thankful that I found this forum with such great support and information.

1. When is your court hearing (case management) 
Today, I managed to speak on the phone with the despatch/messenger. I asked him where is the document.
He said that the bank called him and said "tak perlu hantar" because I already spoken to the bank officer.
Is this a trick by the bank to do substitute service?
Why suddenly do not have to complete the process? I cannot get hold of the bank officer today to clarify, so I will call again tomorrow.
I also managed to get my case number and check at e-filing.kehakiman. Stated there "Pengurusan Kes A" Active, 13 Jul 2017, Lain-lain (B)(1).

2. Post here in full the whole contents of the letter from the bank. Is it an offer letter or just a computer generated standard format with general "information"? 
That is the only main content. The first paragraph is the loan details and value of "tertunggak" $2900 + Bill guaman $1000. Then, last paragraph is:
"Pihak bank berhak debit akaun di atas bagi sebarang jumlah keuntungan/perbelanjaan yang ditanggung oleh Bank hingga tarikh penjelasan sepenuhnya. Sekian, terima kasih"
It is signed by two bank officers. Not computer generated.
I paid the total sum via online today and informed officer via email. Will call him tomorrow. I want a confirmation letter from them.

3. After the first "Reply Affidavit" is filed, what is the next step?
I have to study on the process first. But I will definitely do the best to defeat it as per @notalawyer suggested.

Maybe you can join Avengers Malaysia and help others to fight banks.
I would be happy to help wherever I can.

Lawyers fees for this current bankruptcy proceedings estimated to be in the region of 8-10K? What about Bill Collectors billings? It is sure not going to be the 3, 6K she may have in mind. 
I thought the Bill Guaman $1000 covers this. I will ask for the itemised bill from the bank.

Will update again once I get clarification from the officer. 
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answered on May 4, 2017 at 05:09
by   notalawyer
He said that the bank called him and said "tak perlu hantar" because I already spoken to the bank officer.
Sometimes you know the truth when you hear it.

Is this a trick by the bank to do substitute service?
Most likely not.
However, if due to miscommunication the Notice of Bankruptcy is advertised, you Maybank accounts may become frozen.  Keep minimal funds.

Why suddenly do not have to complete the process?
To save legal costs.

I thought the Bill Guaman $1000 covers this.
1K is the correct amount for initial process which is aborted.
8K is for the full process to make you a bankrupt.

After the first "Reply Affidavit" is filed, what is the next step?
I have to study on the process first. But I will definitely do the best to defeat it as per @notalawyer suggested.

As the bank now refuses to serve you the Notice of Bankruptcy document,
there is nothing to fight for now.
Perhaps they got information that the Avengers are helping you and got scared.
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answered on May 4, 2017 at 05:59
by   BillKlington
The first paragraph is the loan details and value of "tertunggak" $2900 + Bill guaman $1000
Lucky debtor. This lawyer is just asking for the initial costs of THIS bankruptcy proceedings (for their part only). They are not bothered about the judgement debtor part.
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answered on May 4, 2017 at 06:05
by   ThomasGoh
He said that the bank called him and said "tak perlu hantar" because I already spoken to the bank officer. 
Is this a trick by the bank to do substitute service? 
If on the 1st May is the 3rd handservice, do a fourth one?

Check periodically with e-filing to make sure the case is properly closed up.
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answered on May 4, 2017 at 16:03
by   kiki
I also managed to get my case number and check at e-filing.kehakiman. Stated there "Pengurusan Kes A" Active, 13 Jul 2017, Lain-lain (B)(1).
Base on the time frame of the date of Pengurusan Kes it seem they have cater enough time if substitute service is needed.

Check periodically with e-filing to make sure the case is properly closed up.
Yes, and maybe you can also practice to extract the documents filed by the lawyers thru the e-filing.kehakiman site.
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answered on May 4, 2017 at 16:32
by   louise
Hi sallysm,

Are you a single mother?
What is your WeChat ID?
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